an atheist viewpoint

thoughts from a non-theist

Another Ex-Christadelphian Writes

I frequently receive emails from Christadelphians who berate me for leaving their faith and who encourage me to “return to the fold.” Then they invariably conclude their emails by giving me a list of the Christadelphian teachings that they themselves reject, not realising that they have already become Ex-Christadelphians. Often the teachings that they reject are fundamental doctrines and by rights they should be disfellowshipped. The writers then conclude “Please keep this confidential between us” and often sign off “anonymous” fearful that Christadelphian “Big Brother” might get to know of their heresy. 

Read the rest of John Bedson’s excellent piece here.

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10 thoughts on “Another Ex-Christadelphian Writes

  1. Glenn Munro on said:

    To John Bedson and Others,

    I am a brother of Christ and I have no problem with believers who choose to leave their ecclesia.It is not a jail, people have a free will and can vote with their feet.

    I do however have a problem with the ex-christadelphian movement haveing these closed cyber meeting places where they can slander the brotherhood and have a complete ban on any response to the criticism.

    The irony is that this type of dictatorial cencorship of opposing opinion is the very essence of the criticism leveled at the Christadelphians, by the ex-Christadelphians.

    I have been the full circle. I was a Christadelphian for 20years until I committed adultery and was disfellowshipped.

    I had no problem with that as i knew i had done the wrong thing.

    I met someone else a few years later who went to the Church of Christ. I went along to support her and quickly realized the dependance members had on the minister for guidance on biblical doctrine.

    I could not be convinced of the trinity, nor the immortal soul which i pointed out to the minister that these are terms that dont even appear in the bible.

    Rank and file members were not encouraged to study the word for themselves but rather rely on the minister they were paying to come up with the answers.

    I saw first hand the dilemma a minister has to face when the congregation could be split over an issue that would risk his income should many leave.

    I was voted onto a committee to choose the next minister that was facillitated by a transitional minister. My first question at the meeting was ‘Why does this church need a paid minister’? The answer was “so there is an expert in biblical doctrine to lead the church and somone to minister to the sick during the week and visit those in hospital”

    ‘Shouldnt that be the responsibility of all the church” ?I said.

    This was a church of members who were paying someone to do the hard yards.
    All most members had to do was turn up on sunday and that was it.

    For 7 years I was an ecclessia of one person – me.

    Even amongst the Church of Christ, I could listen to common ground and substitute my beliefs when required.

    My 14 year old son at the time said ‘Dad why are you going to a church where they believe different things to you?

    That’s when the penny dropped,why am I compromising?, I thought.

    In 2002 I returned to my ecelssia and one sunday shortly after I got up after the anouncements and apoligised to my bretheren and sisters for being so stupid.

    Ive never looked back.

    Sometimes we lose our way and go in the opposite direction but if your know the truth, nothing else can convince you.

    When I left, I made a clean break, I tried to be as open minded as I could.

    What I found was that I had the truth to begin with.

    The Godless,atheistic concept to me was a cold self centered view which I tried to entertain for a season to relieve myself of the guilt after destroying my family.

    I realised that i had to face up to what I had done despite societies cries of “Just move on, it happens all the time. You shouldnt feel guilty”

    I have made my peace with God, my ex-wife and my family.

    I do know what a lot of you are going thru as we all get disallusioned at times, we lose our perspective. The Human mind is a funny thing.

    A good example is in 1 kings 19 when Elijah goes to great effort to prove his God exists to the people, then collapses under a juniper tree wanting to die when he hears they werent all convinced and wanted to kill him.

    God has his hand outstretched still even though you are wavering.

    He knows for some ,like me that its all part of the journey.

    Cheers

    Glenn Munro

    • I feel this needs responding to point by point –

      I am a brother of Christ and I have no problem with believers who choose to leave their ecclesia.It is not a jail, people have a free will and can vote with their feet.

      I do however have a problem with the ex-christadelphian movement haveing these closed cyber meeting places where they can slander the brotherhood and have a complete ban on any response to the criticism.

      Where is this ‘closed cyber meeting place’? As far as I can tell you’re more than able to post here, and I don’t think Corky’s site blocks comments. Honestly, please tell me what you’re talking about.

      The irony is that this type of dictatorial cencorship of opposing opinion is the very essence of the criticism leveled at the Christadelphians, by the ex-Christadelphians.

      I think a lot of people feel that they should have a right to point out how ghastly the Christadelphian faith is without a crew of CDs turning up and acting like….well…typical CDs online.

      I have been the full circle. I was a Christadelphian for 20years until I committed adultery and was disfellowshipped.

      I had no problem with that as i knew i had done the wrong thing.

      Not quite sure why you felt you needed to share that particular truth nugget…

      I met someone else a few years later who went to the Church of Christ. I went along to support her and quickly realized the dependance members had on the minister for guidance on biblical doctrine.
      I could not be convinced of the trinity, nor the immortal soul which i pointed out to the minister that these are terms that dont even appear in the bible.
      Rank and file members were not encouraged to study the word for themselves but rather rely on the minister they were paying to come up with the answers.
      I saw first hand the dilemma a minister has to face when the congregation could be split over an issue that would risk his income should many leave.
      I was voted onto a committee to choose the next minister that was facillitated by a transitional minister. My first question at the meeting was ‘Why does this church need a paid minister’? The answer was “so there is an expert in biblical doctrine to lead the church and somone to minister to the sick during the week and visit those in hospital”
      ‘Shouldnt that be the responsibility of all the church” ?I said.
      This was a church of members who were paying someone to do the hard yards.
      All most members had to do was turn up on sunday and that was it.

      And while I’m sure that was an interesting experience for you, I’m not sure why you’ve shared that either.

      For 7 years I was an ecclessia of one person – me.

      ‘Where two or more are gathered together in my name, there I am also’, or words to that effect. Sorry, according to the Bible you were one short of ‘an ecclessia’

      Even amongst the Church of Christ, I could listen to common ground and substitute my beliefs when required.
      My 14 year old son at the time said ‘Dad why are you going to a church where they believe different things to you?
      That’s when the penny dropped,why am I compromising?, I thought.

      I’d have thought the penny would have dropped that they’re ALL wrong, but then I’m just skeptical of religious claims

      In 2002 I returned to my ecelssia and one sunday shortly after I got up after the anouncements and apoligised to my bretheren and sisters for being so stupid.

      Ive never looked back.

      So you abandoned your dignity, and publicly apologised to your judgmental peers! Well done!

      Sometimes we lose our way and go in the opposite direction but if your know the truth, nothing else can convince you.

      When I left, I made a clean break, I tried to be as open minded as I could.

      What I found was that I had the truth to begin with.

      Only you DON’T have ‘the truth’ at all, you still believe in the demonstrably false religion of Christianity!

      The Godless,atheistic concept to me was a cold self centered view which I tried to entertain for a season to relieve myself of the guilt after destroying my family.

      ‘Cold’? ‘Self centered’? How dare you! That speaks more of your personality than it does of atheism, which is (don’t forget) nothing more than the lack of belief in gods. I can assure you that I am neither ‘Cold’ nor ‘Self centered’, and most of the atheists I know are the most generous, genuine, loving, giving, and outright in-love-with-life individuals I’ve ever had the pleasure to meet. Compared to the grey, drab, miserable individuals that seemed to make up the bulk of Christadelphia, I know which I’d rather align with.

      I realised that i had to face up to what I had done despite societies cries of “Just move on, it happens all the time. You shouldnt feel guilty”

      No, you SHOULD feel guilty! You shit where you ate, and you rightly took a beating for that.

      I have made my peace with God, my ex-wife and my family.

      Bully for you. Btw, that god of yours? It doesn’t exist.

      I do know what a lot of you are going thru as we all get disallusioned at times, we lose our perspective. The Human mind is a funny thing.

      It IS a funny thing, it causes otherwise entirely rational human beings to believe fantastical bullshit, like the world being only 6000 years old, or the story of a pair of every living thing on the planet fitting into a boat, or that a first century Jewish carpenters son turned water into wine, raised the dead, and himself came back to life after being crucified! Absolutely bonkers, eh?

      A good example is in 1 kings 19 when Elijah goes to great effort to prove his God exists to the people, then collapses under a juniper tree wanting to die when he hears they werent all convinced and wanted to kill him.

      You can’t provide any evidence for something that doesn’t exist.

      God has his hand outstretched still even though you are wavering.

      He knows for some ,like me that its all part of the journey.

      I’m not wavering, I KNOW that no gods exist, or have ever existed.

      • John Bedson on said:

        “I KNOW that no gods exist, or have ever existed.” You can’t KNOW that. You can BELIEVE it, but you can’t KNOW it. I believe that to be true, but it is not something that you can definitively prove.

  2. It is obvious that you are clueless as to what you are discussing. If you had an ounce of grey matter inside that thick head of yours then you would see that atheism is actually a much easier path than christadelphia. With atheism people pick the easiest path and make up their own values, purely to ease their conscience.
    With Christadelphia, you follow and live by values that are much more difficult yet much more fulfilling and right than atheism. And your your comment about atheists being fluffy, loving little bunny rabbits. This entire article kind of contradicts that statement, as anyone with half a brain can see that this is an attack on christadelphians. I actually feel sorry for you that you have to write an article to reassure yourself that your immoral ways that you are living by are right.

    • KY, why don’t you just go and fuck yourself? Talk your self-righteous supercilious bullshit and trot on.

      ‘Immoral way’?? You, son, are a dick of the highest order.

    • KY: You write: With Christadelphia, you follow and live by values that are much more difficult yet much more fulfilling and right than atheism.”

      How can this be true if, as we now know, the Christadelphian Office have stolen several hundred thousand pounds from the Church over the past ten years?

      I may be an atheist, but I was one of the first to offer to donate to the Christadelphian pension fund that had been raided by the editor, Michael Ashton. I wrote to the new Christadelphian magazine editor offering to arrange a collection amongst the Ex-Christadelphians. Andrew Bramhill replied “Thanks for the kind offer of a donation, which is very generous. Actually we are ok for money, although the loss was unwelcome.” What did you offer, KY to help that situation?

      And another thing: Why didn’t the Christadelphians obey their Lord and forgive brother Michael Ashton untill (“sevety times seven”)? (Matthew 18:22) Instead they ignored Christ and fired Mike, disfellowshipped him and then demanded that he repay all the money, even though he has to sell his home to do it, is elderly, has nowhere else to live and his poor wife Jane is inocent of the whole scam? Why punish Jane for her husband’s wickedness?

      You Christadelphians are a bunch of hypocrites who don’t practice what you preach. You don’t even come close to us Atheist when it come to upright morally behaviour.

      And don’t give me the “it was only one person” reply or I will give you a list of other brethen (Mansfield etc) who in my opinion were hypocrites including the brother in Australia who allegedly sexually assaults young sisters at Bible School and the Christadelphian Youth Circle superintendent who was an alleged paedophile. I have a file on heaps of Christadelphians like that and I’ll be pleased to upload it to show that Christadelphians are nothing more than “whited sepulchres” (Matthew 23:27)

      See:

      http://www.birminghammail.net/news/top-stories/2012/02/16/birmingham-christian-charity-faces-probe-over-alleged-disappearance-of-hundreds-of-thousands-of-pounds-97319-30340248/#ixzz1mZG6g9iw

      See:

      “Information on the ongoing Investigation for Major Fraud by the former editor of the Christadelphian Magazine.”

      http://www.christadelphianresearch.com/investigationforfraud.htm

      • “And another thing: Why didn’t the Christadelphians obey their Lord and forgive brother Michael Ashton untill (“sevety times seven”)? (Matthew 18:22) Instead they ignored Christ and fired Mike, disfellowshipped him and then demanded that he repay all the money, even though he has to sell his home to do it, is elderly, has nowhere else to live and his poor wife Jane is inocent of the whole scam? Why punish Jane for her husband’s wickedness?”

        Now wait a minute…there’s forgiveness,but then there’s just letting it go and acting like it’s nothing. He committed a crime. People are SUPPOSED to be punished for crimes they commit, to help them learn that what they did is NOT OK. What brother Ashton did was terrible and he screwed over a ton of people, including his own family. If he had just simply gotten away with it by being “forgiven”, what does that tell him? God forgives us when we ask, but he still allows us to go thru hard times to learn from what we’ve done wrong. Mr. Ashton deserved every bit of punishment that he got.

      • Alex Botten on said:

        Let he who is without sin cast the first stone….ring any bells?

  3. Has anything more come of this. This sounds so serious. The CMPA fellowship seeems to have covered this up quite well. I guess it’s old news. Did Mike have to sell his house? Did he pay back this money. Did his wife suffer? What about his kids? What is UP with all this?

  4. No one knows. It has all been covered up by the CMPA. It’s a disgrace the way it was all handled. It was open defiance of the teachings of Christ. Not that I care; I’m an Atheist.

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