an atheist viewpoint

thoughts from a non-theist

My Email Conversation with Sye Tenbruggencate….

….has come to an end. He tried every single one of the tricks that I’d read were his stock in trade, but none of them altered the fact that his basic ‘argument’ is entirely circular, and relies upon that which it is trying to prove being already true to be able to make its point.

When I asked him to prove that gods exist WITHOUT using his circular argument, he seemed thoroughly stumped, and kept trying to come back to his pre-sup nonsense.

For a man running a website called ‘Proof that God Exists’ he is remarkably short on any evidence to support his claim.

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7 thoughts on “My Email Conversation with Sye Tenbruggencate….

  1. There is a reason that Scripture calls the "reasoning" of atheists "foolish." That you cannot see the vicious circularity of YOUR view, never ceases to amaze me. You see, if I ask you to justify the validity of your reasoning, YOU must appeal to your reasoning, which makes YOUR view VICIOUSLY circular. To say that the same applies to me, is to employ reasoning, which you simply cannot justify. It would take sheer intellectual dishonesty to posit that God COULD NOT reveal some things to us (such as the reliablity of our reasoning), such that we can be certain of it, but that is what you must be reduced to in order to vainly attempt to shore up your vacuous position.

  2. I bet there was a time when Sye did not hold this position and used his "reasoning" to evaluate the position he now holds.I wonder if YHWH could make him certain of something that is not true…

  3. JC, I wonder that myself. Sye, the TAG/presup is nothing more than word games, and says nothing/proves nothing about the real world.If you're insistent that human reasoning cannot be trusted without your god then you are bound by the same rules. Your claims are the result of your reasoning, reasoning which you have already stated cannot be trusted. You say that your god has revealed to you the truth of this, but this too depends on your ability to reason correctly, something you say you cannot do. JC is right, there was a point before you believed this particular idea, and you used your reasoning to decide it was correct – REASONING THAT YOU SAY CANNOT BE TRUSTED. If you are right you have no way of knowing it, due to your assertion that human reasoning cannot be trusted or understood without god.You've dug a hole for yourself as an illustration of how you'd try and trap others.

  4. Additionally, the 'laws of logic' that Sye and Matt Slick are so fond of only exist in discussions of the TAG/presup – no-where else will you find the phrase used. It's a classic strawman – invent something, say that only a god can account for that invention, ?, PROFIT.

  5. Sye:     Very well, we are in agreement that a powerful trickster has "revealed" falsehoods in such a way (this method you never make plain) that you are "certain" that they are true. Your god and your website are lies. And you should slink quietly home.     At any rate, you have known for some time tht non-christians simply accept reasoning as a necessary foundational premise. In any system of beliefs there need to be foundational premises that are not "justified" by anything else. You do this too; but you try to keep others on the defensive.

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